Favoriting Techtonic with Mark Hurst: Playlist from April 23, 2018 Favoriting

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Conversations with creators and thinkers who are charting the way forward in a tech-saturated society. In our shift to a digital future, we need alternatives to Big Tech. Homepage: techtonic.fm

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Favoriting April 23, 2018: Columbia Business School prof. Len Sherman on business models online

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This week: Columbia Business School professor Len Sherman on the effect of business models in our online experience.

Pointers to Len's work:

If You're In A Dogfight, Become A Cat, by Len Sherman, on Indiebound

Can Mark Zuckerberg Fix Facebook's Mess? and Why Facebook Will Never Change Its Business Model, recent Forbes.com columns

• Len on Twitter: @lenshermanCBS

Len's homepage

...but first, as usual, we'll start with tech news:



Recent News

Where Countries Are Tinderboxes and Facebook Is a Match, by Amanda Taub and Max Fisher in the NYT. “Time and again, communal hatreds overrun the newsfeed — the primary portal for news and information for many users — unchecked as local media are displaced by Facebook and governments find themselves with little leverage over the company. Some users, energized by hate speech and misinformation, plot real-world attacks. ... ‘You report to Facebook, they do nothing,’ one of the researchers, Amalini De Sayrah, said. ‘There’s incitements to violence against entire communities and Facebook says it doesn’t violate community standards.’”

Jaron Lanier speaking about Facebook and Google as “behavior modification empires” that “rely on behavior modification and spying” for their business models. It’s cheaper to pay them to ruin things than to make positive change. Perhaps, Lanier says, it’s time for subscription fees. (Hey, it worked for HBO and Netflix!) “I don’t believe our species can survive unless we fix this,” Lanier concludes. “In the meantime, if the companies won’t change, delete your accounts.”

Interview with Jaron Lanier in New York Magazine: “A lot of the rhetoric of Silicon Valley that has the utopian ring about creating meaningful communities where everybody’s creative and people collaborate and all this stuff — I don’t wanna make too much of my own contribution, but I was kind of the first author of some of that rhetoric a long time ago. So it kind of stings for me to see it misused. Like, I used to talk about how virtual reality could be a tool for empathy, and then I see Mark Zuckerberg talking about how VR could be a tool for empathy while being profoundly nonempathic, using VR to tour Puerto Rico after the storm, after Maria. One has this feeling of having contributed to something that’s gone very wrong.”

Techno-Fundamentalism Can’t Save You, Mark Zuckerberg, by UVA professor Siva Vaidhyanathan

The New Octopus, by K. Sabeel Rahman in Logic mag.

Who Has More of Your Personal Data Than Facebook? Try Google, writes Christopher Mims in the WSJ. More on Google soon...



For our sing along tonight:

Building a surveillance state
Google, Google
Privacy is what they hate
All Google day

It's Facebook, too
They're spying on you
We've got to change before it's too late
All Google day

- - -

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Artist Track Images Approx. start time
  Mark speaks with Columbia Business School professor Len Sherman on the effect that business models have the internet.
Tomaš Dvořák  Game Boy Tune   Favoriting    
  Mark's intro  
Favoriting
 
A Small Woodland Animal  Building A Surveillance State   Favoriting
Favoriting
0:15:07 (Pop-up)
  Interview with Columbia Business School professor Len Sherman  
Favoriting
0:18:47 (Pop-up)
  Your calls and comments 201-209-9368  
Favoriting
0:37:18 (Pop-up)


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Listener comments!

Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:00pm
listener james from westwood:

How do, Mark and all!! Pre-travel packing frenzy but happy to catch this show live!
  6:02pm
melinda:

Hi all!
  6:02pm
melinda:

Where ya headed James?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:03pm
Bas NL:

Hi Mark!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:04pm
common:

hey!
Avatar 6:04pm
geezerette:

Hi, Mark & Techtonics.
www.nytimes.com...

Article about Twitter-keeper for Trump.
Haven't read but looks well worth it.
Avatar 6:05pm
northguineahills:

Changed clothes from random feces I got all over my clothes via my garden hose, and got back to work, and realized there are still some in my shoe treads. Sock footed at work scrubbing my shoes (Big Fun!)
Avatar 🤖 6:09pm
herb.nyc:

how about adding ... 2019: no
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:10pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

If only we could get computers embedded in our brains and they could do all the work and thinking.
Avatar 🤖 6:13pm
herb.nyc:

re fb sri lanka article in nytimes - i'm thinking of movie "network" now, as the news anchor is using t.v. news to start a revolution.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:16pm
Bas NL:

From May 25th we have the new EU General Data Protection Regulation to control the use of personal data on the internet. It's big.
Avatar 🤖 6:18pm
herb.nyc:

boo hoo, i am a rain drop
Avatar 6:19pm
geezerette:

Bas, we need that. :(
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:19pm
Tommy in Neversink:

I was wondering when we would have a sing along..but didn't know how to bring it up
  6:19pm
sim:

Once the avalanche has begun, it is too late for the pebbles to cry stop.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:19pm
ultradamno:

Not even on Chipmunk Punk?
  Swag For Life Member 6:21pm
drew:

Thanks for having the Jaron interview. I'm big fan of his.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:21pm
Phil with the phone:

please don't make me sing this
Avatar 6:21pm
Linda Lee:

oh dear me, help. no.
Avatar 🤖 6:21pm
herb.nyc:

this song has reached #1 on the woodland mammals charts
Avatar 6:21pm
northguineahills:

Too late Phil and Linda!
Avatar 6:22pm
geezerette:

Where's the bouncing ball?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:23pm
Bas NL:

Bouncing ball! Yes!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:23pm
ultradamno:

Nice A-Ha-ified meme
  6:23pm
Doug C.:

Well. Hard to make out the lyrics but they are true. I’m in for the singalong.
Avatar 6:23pm
Linda Lee:

ok ... the product is social media. who is the 'social'? jeez!
  6:24pm
sim:

Uncertain how better Netflix subscription model is. They are rather bouyed by stock valuation than subscriptions. Additionally, they have deep metrics on viewership as to what people will watch and develop accordingly.
Avatar 6:24pm
geezerette:

Auntie Social.
  Swag For Life Member 6:26pm
drew:

Ah. I misunderstood. Jaron's elsewhere. Please do have him on.
Avatar 6:27pm
geezerette:

We could connect with people BEFORE fb.
Avatar 6:28pm
Linda Lee:

of course!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:28pm
Bas NL:

I like the WFMU business model best!
Avatar 6:29pm
geezerette:

Otherwise none of us would even be here.
Howdy Linda Lee!

What Bas said. :)
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:30pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

(...no business @ all...)
Evening.
Avatar 6:30pm
Linda Lee:

hi geezerette!
Avatar 6:31pm
Linda Lee:

looking at the fmu model is actually interesting: offer somethiing of great value that's meaningful & the community will support it happily. no need to sell it to them or sell them to it.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:32pm
Fuzzy:

Perusing the internet without an ad blocker is insane.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:32pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...personally...I'm sick of Corporations & Governments & Institutions saying they Serve &/or Represent us - & they take our money
...& they want *us* to have no privacy
...& they offer *no* transparency - & *no* ACCOUNTABILITY whatsoever...
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:32pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

@Bas - I heard about that. I hope it helps things. www.eugdpr.org...
Avatar 6:34pm
northguineahills:

True, sim, they sell that data as well, but ideally it's easier for them to keep it anonymous. Whether they do or not, is another subject.
Avatar 6:34pm
geezerette:

Rev Rab! Can't disagree.

Linda, WFMU is utopian!
  6:35pm
JakeGould:

@Fuzzy: …in 2016 onwards.

In 1996 when I worked in web publishing people gave me crap about ads being tracked on the site I worked on. Guess what? Ads were reasonable there and the analytics were trivial.

I think the world of ad tech in the current age is straight out creepy. More nefarious than anything that existed in 1996 and such.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:35pm
Bas NL:

@Ken: Facebook, Google, Microsoft are working feverishly to comply; the fines are 4% of yearly profits WORLDWIDE.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:37pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

CrowdFunding...What I wonder: Ultimate organic Socialism - or Libertarianism - ?? The idea that an unregulated Market is some kind of Natiural state - like dollars are like oak leaves or something...
...Of course - CryptoCurrency is about to rock Finance to the core...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:38pm
Fuzzy:

@Jake: you said it. It's a straight-up malware vector now. I cannot and will not browse the web without a blocker now (using Ublock Origin and Cookie Autodelete extensions with Firefox these days.)
Avatar 6:39pm
geezerette:

Endless disruption is only good for people who stand atop pyramids.
Avatar 6:40pm
northguineahills:

My brothers have never read anything that school didn't assign them unless it was a sports website, and they're in their mid-30s. They actually asked me how do I read books?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:41pm
Mark Hurst:

Hi everybody! Thanks for the great comments. Here's Adblock Plus: adblockplus.org
Avatar 6:42pm
Linda Lee:

ngh ~ you'll need to send them a video of how you read books. sitting? reclining? dressed? bright light? low light .. ?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:42pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...read in the tub...
Avatar 6:44pm
northguineahills:

@Linda: Usually w/ a pint by the light of my phone.
Avatar 6:44pm
βrian:

I agree with Fuzzy.
Avatar 6:44pm
Linda Lee:

there you go! :-)
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:45pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

I can't begin to keep up. Appreciating this Program as a Podcast might help me...
Avatar 6:45pm
geezerette:

You read with your eyes, tell 'em it's just like scrolling but you turn pages instead.
Avatar 6:46pm
βrian:

We need a big data cloaca that will collect it all and mix it up. Project Cloaca, maybe.
Avatar 6:46pm
Linda Lee:

Ken: extrapolate from there & you develop a false persona. thereafter taking part in social media has no value.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:46pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

For funs, I took a look at the Bumble app the other day. To complete installation, it wanted access to all kinds of phone info: location, call records, contact list, etc. Did not proceed.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:47pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...that's what I liked about MySpace - Friending fictional characters...very creative it seemed...
Avatar 6:47pm
geo in jc:

Ken's name is actually Larry.
Avatar 6:47pm
βrian:

I always confuse MyFace with SpaceBook.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:48pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...the President s AndyKaufman...
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:49pm
Bas NL:

I did concert reviews on MySpace.. until MySpace deleted the blog space without prior notice.. Big bummer.
Avatar 6:49pm
geezerette:

Hey! It's a real place. Pismo Beach.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:50pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

I saw some news headline today that mentioned many Amazon reviews are written by paid product employees and not independent product consumers. Imagine that!
  6:51pm
JakeGould:

A non-profit Facebook would be NPRbook. Everyone gets a ^*@%! tote bag!
Avatar 6:51pm
geezerette:

shocked, Ken FHP, shocked!
Avatar 6:52pm
βrian:

If that tote bag is made of heavy duty woven hemp, that works for me.
Avatar 6:52pm
Linda Lee:

on NPRbook corporate reps have their own personal accounts & have you believe they're users just like you.
  6:52pm
JakeGould:

@Ken: Ever go on Zappos? All the reviews are great! All of the shoes are comfortable and cozy and the best thing everyone has bought!
Avatar 6:52pm
Carmichael:

Just got here. Who thinks Pismo ain't real?!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:52pm
ultradamno:

There will be a Black Mirror episode where deleting a replicant account will punishable as murder.
Avatar 6:53pm
βrian:

A nonprofit FB would require one hell of a kickstarter campaign to get it going.
Avatar 6:53pm
Linda Lee:

James Corbett is busy investigating new social media models right now the issue now seems to be: ways to draw users. a couple of them are using cryptocurrency to do it. with currency you have gaming though.
  6:53pm
JakeGould:

How about a Facebook, but just for dudes? Call it “Dudebook: No Chicks Allowed”
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:53pm
melinda:

I would love a facebook alternative. I worry that most people aren't disturbed enough by the facebook model to try another platform.
Avatar 6:54pm
geezerette:

Carm, already don't remember...:0
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:54pm
Smokestack:

There are plenty of other social media platforms. It's just that how are you going to get a critical mass of people to all switch over to it? It could happen--but it's many years off
  6:54pm
tooplin:

THE AUDIENCE ENGINE!!!!!!!!!
Avatar 6:55pm
Linda Lee:

@Smokestack ~ this is why steemit, yours.com are using cryptocurrency. making contributions rewarding materially.
Avatar 6:56pm
Linda Lee:

.. but money is *too* rewarding! so the value to users has to be immaterial.
  6:56pm
JakeGould:

I want to build a social media site for people who play “Mr. Do.” Who’s with me?
  6:56pm
Mister Eddie:

What user information does FMU collect?
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Bas NL:

We do need to be able to post pictures here though.. (hint)
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

Is the Tech behind fb, iTunes &tc. really so exclusive & unable to be replicated? One thing they say about CryptoCurrency : the Encryption takes a lot of electrical energy: ServerFarms have big impact...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:56pm
Smokestack:

Who knows, Facebook could totally fall apart next year. Something will come out of the ashes of that
Avatar 6:57pm
βrian:

But agitated gifs should be anathema.
Avatar 6:57pm
Linda Lee:

Mister Eddie ~ FMU requires actual DNA sampling to join. not really. you need nothing but math skills.
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:57pm
queems:

this is hilarious
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
melinda:

@Rabbit the energy use is a really troubling aspect of cryptocurrency.
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

Save this for the next Hoof and Mouth!
  6:58pm
Jay Goges:

I like the disjointed vocals! Hahaha
  6:58pm
Mister Eddie:

Are you sure?
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:58pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

- & Quantum is gonna blast us into another sphere...
Avatar Swag For Life Member 6:59pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

...cause we'er just bored w/ all this - don'chaknow...
Avatar 6:59pm
Linda Lee:

BasNL ~ we do have listeners' flickrs. but it's flickr!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 6:59pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

Blockchainbook!
Avatar Swag For Life Member 7:00pm
Revolution Rabbit Nov63:

@KenFHP: That could be it.
Avatar 7:00pm
northguineahills:

Thanks Mark, Kim, Phil, Dan, and Len!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 7:00pm
Bas NL:

Thanks Mark & all!
Avatar 7:00pm
geezerette:

YAY! clap clap clap!
Avatar 7:01pm
Linda Lee:

i was just talking about an arts-based facebook that isn't about marketing. just about creative ideas & mutual support. like any artsists' community. does it exist? non profit?
Avatar 7:01pm
Linda Lee:

there's an example of intrinsic value.
Avatar 7:02pm
geezerette:

Linda Lee, if you find it please please tell us!
Avatar 7:02pm
Linda Lee:

the secret could be: look at the kinds of support people look for on FB & don't get. that's what we need to provide, non profit.
i will!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 7:03pm
Bas NL:

There is a great sharing spirit in the programmers community.. think Linux, GNU, GitHub etc.
Avatar 7:03pm
Linda Lee:

might have to make it up!
Avatar 7:03pm
Linda Lee:

needs a strong visual component.
Avatar 7:03pm
geezerette:

:D !
Avatar 7:04pm
Linda Lee:

sound component too. for music & sound arts.
Avatar 7:04pm
Linda Lee:

someone forgot to close the board. :-D
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 7:04pm
Ken From Hyde Park:

I hate how you pay for cable TV and have to watch ads anyway. What a scam!
Avatar 🤖 Swag For Life Member 7:04pm
Bas NL:

'Artify'
Avatar 7:05pm
Linda Lee:

there you go Bas!
Avatar 7:05pm
geezerette:

Bas, that sounds like a drug!
  7:48pm
Abandon Social Everything:

This is an alternative to Facebook that has always intrigued me but I have not tried it out: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diaspora_(social_network)
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